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starladyMany other people have said things I agree with, especially fairestcat, about the bullshit from the WSFS about how AO3 contributors shouldn't refer to ourselves as winners of a tiny fraction of a Hugo Award. The short answer is they're wrong, we are, and we already got our fangirl cooties all over their serious phallic rocket. And they can't change that AO3 did win and we are here; their own fucking members, many of whom are AO3 contributors themselves, voted us the award. Die mad, assholes.
But. I do want to specifically say that the WSFS claims about their trademarks and about U.S. trademark laws are a steaming pile of horseshit. Trademarks are specifically different from copyright and the standards for their use and violation (or "dilution," depending on the case) are in many cases much more stringent. I am not a lawyer, and even I know this. There's a post made on AO3 by a dude who is apparently a trademark lawyer which attempts to obfuscate the specific argument about dilution of trademarks that the WSFS is trying to make, and it's a bunch of unrelated examples that don't apply to this situation. (I also strongly question his professional judgment in making that post; it seems unwise, and he's also specifically not counsel for the WSFS so can't actually comment on specifics.) Furthermore, a trademark cannot be used to compel protected speech (i.e. jokes on Twitter). This is another piece of WSFS' history of overreaching on trademarks, but here's the thing: we don't have to be cowed just because of random dudes making long, serious-seeming posts, even if they have a JD. If there's one thing the OTW and the AO3 have stood for and proved over the past decade and change, it's that we can do things for ourselves. And we can do some pretty amazing things!
I'm not even getting into the fact that as far as I can tell the WSFS has registered its precious trademarks only in the U.S. and the EU (which undoubtedly has different standards for trademarks that I don't know, and I'd bet a good chunk of change the WSFS has no idea about either). Despite the fact that they're allegedly so concerned about these trademarks' dilution, they haven't even registered them in the country hosting the next Worldcon, and they've apparently let them expire in Canada. They're also not registered in Australia, which has hosted Worldcon four times already, the most recent in 2010.
All of which is to say that their claims about this whole kerfuffle being about trademarks are obviously bullshit--Kevin didn't even start mentioning trademarks until the comments on the AO3 news post--but also that merchandise, whether it be pins, T-shirts, badge ribbons, or whatever, using the phrase(s) "Hugo Award(s)" is totally legal in most of the world. Including New Zealand. And that even though they're trying to gatekeep us out of their precious science fiction, we're already inside the gates. And this too shall pass. And in the meantime, we are still all winners of a tiny fraction of a Hugo Award, because we built the AO3 ourselves, whether as volunteers or creators. Here's to us. We're pretty damn awesome.
fairestcat, about the bullshit from the WSFS about how AO3 contributors shouldn't refer to ourselves as winners of a tiny fraction of a Hugo Award. The short answer is they're wrong, we are, and we already got our fangirl cooties all over their serious phallic rocket. And they can't change that AO3 did win and we are here; their own fucking members, many of whom are AO3 contributors themselves, voted us the award. Die mad, assholes.But. I do want to specifically say that the WSFS claims about their trademarks and about U.S. trademark laws are a steaming pile of horseshit. Trademarks are specifically different from copyright and the standards for their use and violation (or "dilution," depending on the case) are in many cases much more stringent. I am not a lawyer, and even I know this. There's a post made on AO3 by a dude who is apparently a trademark lawyer which attempts to obfuscate the specific argument about dilution of trademarks that the WSFS is trying to make, and it's a bunch of unrelated examples that don't apply to this situation. (I also strongly question his professional judgment in making that post; it seems unwise, and he's also specifically not counsel for the WSFS so can't actually comment on specifics.) Furthermore, a trademark cannot be used to compel protected speech (i.e. jokes on Twitter). This is another piece of WSFS' history of overreaching on trademarks, but here's the thing: we don't have to be cowed just because of random dudes making long, serious-seeming posts, even if they have a JD. If there's one thing the OTW and the AO3 have stood for and proved over the past decade and change, it's that we can do things for ourselves. And we can do some pretty amazing things!
I'm not even getting into the fact that as far as I can tell the WSFS has registered its precious trademarks only in the U.S. and the EU (which undoubtedly has different standards for trademarks that I don't know, and I'd bet a good chunk of change the WSFS has no idea about either). Despite the fact that they're allegedly so concerned about these trademarks' dilution, they haven't even registered them in the country hosting the next Worldcon, and they've apparently let them expire in Canada. They're also not registered in Australia, which has hosted Worldcon four times already, the most recent in 2010.
All of which is to say that their claims about this whole kerfuffle being about trademarks are obviously bullshit--Kevin didn't even start mentioning trademarks until the comments on the AO3 news post--but also that merchandise, whether it be pins, T-shirts, badge ribbons, or whatever, using the phrase(s) "Hugo Award(s)" is totally legal in most of the world. Including New Zealand. And that even though they're trying to gatekeep us out of their precious science fiction, we're already inside the gates. And this too shall pass. And in the meantime, we are still all winners of a tiny fraction of a Hugo Award, because we built the AO3 ourselves, whether as volunteers or creators. Here's to us. We're pretty damn awesome.
(no subject)
Date: 2019-09-21 02:14 (UTC)I have been under a rock for several weeks (and also, I suspect, in different internet spaces) and had not seen the bullshit. Thanks for the précis. Also, seriously.
(no subject)
Date: 2019-09-22 05:11 (UTC)I said this on Twitter but the other thing about it is that they don't even have their own gd Twitter account to try to bully us from, they sent the OTW a statement to post on the AO3 news page and they made posts on AO3 and they made LJ posts. Other people's websites! Our websites! LJ, still! That is where they are making their nasty stupid comments. It's like arguing with the spirit of 2002, if the spirit of 2002 was a fucking numpty.
(no subject)
Date: 2019-09-22 21:02 (UTC)I've just seen the summary at
they sent the OTW a statement to post on the AO3 news page
Well, that's stunningly passive-aggressive!
It's like arguing with the spirit of 2002, if the spirit of 2002 was a fucking numpty.
I have started referring to it as a dumpster snowball: it's not quite enough of a crisis for a dumpster fire, but is is garbage and it just keeps going.